251 games happened, so 32 games didnt have a callvote change map in it, that must be counted as people didnt want to change the map which is the same as vote fail because the map didnt change.
Only fortification took me hours, since I searched each instance of each day where fortification was loaded and searched for a map change inside those lines and what was the result, doing ATCS, Niveus and other maps is gonna take forever.
Ahhhhh okay I see, Thank you. But I think that would be a separate statistic in itself, because this is solely based on /callvote map SUCCESS rate, not the total number of times the map has been played WITHOUT a /callvote map.
To reiterate, the statistic I was talking about refers to ONLY when /callvote map is used.
It does NOT refer to when fortification is played through entirely without a /callvote map
I enjoy playing Fortification, but currently I don’t feel the need to call it often since it comes back on the server soon enough, I even tolerate an atcs match if necessary before playing fortification. A map can be enjoyed without having to play it all day everyday (I would not want to play any map that much). With that said, as I mentioned, the frequency at which fortification shows in the rotation could be reduced a bit.
But regarding the stats, keep in mind that often when a failed map is called, there are usually multiple attempts to change a map.
Chances are that number of games that a map change was not called is much larger, for the above reason that failed votes are often attempted multiple times in the same match.
Something else to consider, how many different unique players called the failed votes?
This is the [quote=“bird, post:51, topic:673”]
The underground hallways and dome are not viable for aliens as they are too wide, tall, and open.
I was referring to.
This was not spoken on in post #51 but these halls are simply too tall. In a match between a dretch and rifle (of exact same skill level respectively) the rifle should always win. The halls are too tall making mazey dretch wall runs harder and allowing humans to backpedal or strafe you easier. Compared to the hallways on ATCS, these are much harder for aliens. Also the sloped triangular edges on both sides of the hall do not favor goons when they are trying to chomp a dancing helmet.
I have built many forwards and even the main alien base in that location, and we won most of those times. also the parallel hall to the left can make a good location for the OM and other things. Another thing to keep in mind is that these forwards and even the main base can be built there temporarily for recovery or strategic positioning, and then move somewhere else later.
This is true and I appreciate you noticing something strategic like this but sadly you and I both know that these days it is hard to find a competent builder who will dedicate himself to the reparation and potential mobilization of a base at any given time. Not many builders today have the foresight to actively move/touch up the base according to the human’s patterns. I personally would build all the time but as I’ve made threads about before in the past, there is no real incentive to building (at least for me). I appreciate stats or visible scores and unfortunately both building classes don’t have a lot to show for their good work, all the more reason to incentivize building through designation protection or some sort of modification to the scoreboard.
Actually I really enjoy building in trem (besides the combat), although 1.1 vanilla is far more limiting in terms of what you can do strategically than in other game plays, Fortification is one of those maps where you can see a lot more variation and dynamics in game play even for 1.1 vanilla. ATCS, especially in 1.1 vanilla, almost always results in the same general base layouts/locations, and in 1.1 vanilla you rarely see much forwarding nor significant moving.
As a side note, this might be a bit off topic, but I personally don’t care at all about my score, I’m more interested in figuring out ways to strategically win, which can include strategic building, strategic killing, strategic rushes, and killing enemy buildables strategically. I can significantly contribute to winning the game with even a single digit kill score. But yeah, scoring should more accurately reflect this kind of game play, and forwarding/moving should be a lot more viable in the game play (requiring much less time/attention).
I haven’t played the map (or Tremulous in general) since the BP was reduced, but I see absolutely no reason why it could not be just 100 BP. If it’s a map in rotation 2, with some already insanely good base locations, 140 BP is definitely still too much for a map that is in rotation 2.
My opinion in this situation is irrelevant, since I am not one of the 15 people who still plays Tremulous.
No, it promotes making even harder to kill bases with the 140 BP. Extra BP will never be enough to encourage building forward bases. GPP did a great job of promoting small forwards with the change to Repeaters, but in 1.1, increasing the BP just makes bases stronger and harder to kill.
For Fortification specifically (not necessarily for many/most/all of the other maps) 140 bp (in 1.1 vanilla) doesn’t seem to make the main bases significantly harder to kill for either team, compared to 100 bp on other maps such as atcs. If anything it feels like even with the 140 bp on Fortification, the human base at least is easier to kill than 100 bp on atcs (in 1.1 vanilla). I do see forwards being made on fortification more often on other maps, but still with the nature of 1.1 vanilla it is true that building is usually concentrated in single main bases.
But the previous bp level of Fortification (I think it was 250 or 200?) was definitely way too high for 1.1 vanilla.
You should try a bunch of matches on the latest Fortification.
GPP vanilla almost had something right with that, but it was flawed when you could fit multiple repeater build zones in mid to large sized rooms, and be restricted in adjacent areas when the repeater buildzones passed through walls. So many times you would still get areas with “too many” buildables, and other areas with “too few”.
The rotation has been updated (refer to the original post in this topic). Fortification will be occurring less frequently. Karith, arachnid2_mjed, and nexus6 will show up a bit more frequently in the rotation than before. I’ve also adjusted the rotation to have a bit more variety. The rotation may need some further adjustments, but lets see how this goes for the next week or so.