A GrangerPub gameplay disruption log

[MaeJong]

@DevHC

i mean after removing the dickhead.

How do U want me to do that? Plug a potato into the craptop’s USB ports to give it extra processing power so I can reach a refresh rate higher than 10 fps? Spawn players magically out of my ass or putteam people and piss them off?

[DevHC]

@MaeJong

How do U want me to do that? Plug a potato into the craptop’s USB ports to give it extra processing power so I can reach a refresh rate higher than 10 fps?

u don’t need moar than 10 FPS to lascamp on the reactor.

[MaeJong]

@DevHC

u don’t need moar than 10 FPS to lascamp on the reactor.

I have better shit to do than sit on the RC with a lasgun for 45mns to be honest.

[Hendrich]

@MaeJong

Plug a potato into the craptop’s USB ports to give it extra processing power so I can reach a refresh rate higher than 10 fps?

I just want you to know that you legit made my day with this shit. Laughed my fucking ass off.

@DevHC

u don’t need moar than 10 FPS to lascamp on the reactor.

[citation needed]

[faceman]

oh man i missed some critical disruption events.

@DevHC

{$}rohaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa* pushed /dev/humancontrolled down from boxes/ledges below to the tyrant infestation, and chat-laughed hard and smacktalked about it. a group of semi-servertakeoverers, including OVO DA PASCOA, PDG|Nicolas21550, admin support2 and possibly others, voted against the kick vote for this action, the vote failed. *<{Helper Bot not only didn’t affirm the issue, but also specifically denied further kickvotes, saying that a valid reason must be provided; he even played dumb, effectively asserting that there were only some other „dummy” kickvotes; he also provided the following fuckface instruction: „Go to grangerhub.org to toe forums” „And then report there with proof on the player report section”. the group later votekicked /dev/humancontroller out, during which admin support gave a remark: „thats devhc”, and which *<{Helper Bot also didn’t contest.32 that’s a player’s name.

LOL

[DevHC]

@Hero

@asbestos

admins don’t care

I assure you, I care. I wouldn’t be posting right now if I didn’t.

admin-actions speak the truth more than forum posts. ur clanmate doesn’t give a fuck, even supports Desala, and causes the otherwise most prominent GrangerHub developer to turn against the project.

[Ckit]

@DevHC

Fk|Elan reduced /dev/humancontroller’s admin level from 2 to 1.

WRONG!

[DevHC]

@Ckit

@DevHC

Fk|Elan reduced /dev/humancontroller’s admin level from 2 to 1.

WRONG!

how do u know ? u weren’t there, were u ? do the server logs show that such a decrease in admin level did not happen ?

[Menace13]

@DevHC

how do u know ? u weren’t there, were u ? do the server logs show that such a decrease in admin level did not happen ?

Fk|Elan, also known as Fk|Hero, does not have !setlevel on GrangerPub.

[DevHC]

@Menace13

Fk|Elan, also known as Fk|Hero

hmm, post fixed. fucking lies uncovered.

ya know, this may turn out to be a call for a new „GrangerHub forum disruption log” thread.

does not have !setlevel on GrangerPub.

this must mean that he did not have /setlevel at that time, unless u’re trying to lie with safety of repudiability by hiding an unobvious interpretation (ie., „fact: now he does not have /setlevel — unless he’s a dickhead, he will attempt to interpret this by assuming good faith”). so through which admin was i admin-leveled down ?

[MaeJong]

@DevHC

hmm, post fixed.

WRONG! In fact you just broke it.

Active aminz with setlevel: virus, ckit, cron, sparky, shuffle and me

[Menace13]

@DevHC

so through which admin was i admin-leveled down ?

@MaeJong

Active aminz with setlevel: virus, ckit, cron, sparky, shuffle and me

Feel free to ask around. Hero has never had !setlevel on GrangerPub to my knowledge, and at the very least, definitely not in the past few months (not sure if his level ever had access to !setlevel in the past).

[MaeJong]

Only level 9s ever had access to !setlevel on pub and club.

[DevHC]

@MaeJong

@DevHC

hmm, post fixed [by changing the blame from „on Fk|Hero’s clanmate” to „on Fk|Hero himself”].

WRONG! In fact you just broke it.

Active aminz with setlevel: virus, ckit, cron, sparky, shuffle and me

ah, i believe i can piece the puzzle together — GG. the perpetrator is Fk|Hero’s only clanmate with /setlevel permissions: Fk|Ckit ! amirite ?

[Ckit]

Bingo.

[Hendrich]

Yes, of course. All the pieces have fallen together. The pawns lined up for their king. It all makes sense now. Ckit was Old Man Hank the whole time.

And with this knowledge, this means … what, exactly? Ckit and Hero are trying to take over GrangerPub, then the world?

You are free to make whatever claims you desire, but that doesn’t necessarily mean they are true. Without evidence, they are basically opinions presented as a “disruption log”.

If you actually wish to contest the validity of what happened to you, do so by making a report in the appropriate section. I’m sure the admins responsible will be glad to explain their decisions and provide the relevant evidence behind their actions. Not here.

[DevHC]

@Hendrich

this means … what, exactly?

that we now know who r responsible for the upcoming assaults on Granger*.

report in the appropriate section
[…]
Without evidence, they are basically opinions presented as a “disruption log”.

1. u seem to have a PROBLEM.
2. where the shit have u been ? tl;dr ?
3. do u still have the PROBLEM ? if yes, what is it ?

[Hendrich]

@DevHC

do u still have the PROBLEM

Sure. Heres one of them:

@DevHC

we now know who r responsible for the upcoming assaults on Granger*

Do we?

HOWEVER, PREVIOUSLY ON GRANGERHUB:

@DevHC

the only hard evidence is the server logs.

And yet, despite this finding:

@DevHC

i’ve made a great share of reports, and i still somewhat continue to do so, though only in PROPER™* channels, like IRC — this is a protest against the retarded system currently in operation**, and this thread is itself a protest;

*** = WRONG

So you have a PROBLEM with the administration, but you are protesting against it by not actually making a report in the proper category where the server logs can actually be dumped, where admins can discuss with the users and the alleged offenders on what happened or if a case can even be made.

And based on what I can understand of your position, this is bad becase:

@DevHC

unless an act of malice is completely recognized and attributed, players r maximally burdened with an encumbering process of proactively preparing to and reporting cases.

Good. Just as admins are expected to take the initiative to do their job, players are expected to take the initiative to report malicious behaviour. That is, unless if /ignore or /callvotes fail. If admins are not available, then players need to prove malice before we start banning people to our heart’s content. You see the current report process as burdening, I see it as necessary to ensure that we are handing out decisions to alleged violators properly. I disagree with your point.

@DevHC

there should be 100s of bans and plenty of demotions.

And this is my fundamental PROBLEM. No, we should NOT be handing out “100s” of bans and demotions in a community as niche and small as Tremulous. The bans/demotions we should be handing out should be done according to the rules on a per-case basis and handed out selectively. We don’t hand them out like candy. Your solution to this problem seems to be:

@DevHC

then u don’t just find a few admins, but enough to cover all time frames with reasonable probability: the more statistically active the time frame, the more admins covering it is desired.

What is the “reasonable probability”? What are “all” the time frames? How do we measure how “statistically active” the timeframe is? Who is A) willing to do all of this FOR FREE and B) make sure this information is accurate? You? No, it’d have to be us.

So allow me to try to lay out your plan for everyone:

1. Advertise more admin positions (because if we need admins, we can’t be passive)
2. Hire X more admins by:
   2a. Have them go through the proper selection process to decide if they’re competent
   2b. Based on rejections, keep hiring admins until we have X amount
   2c. Put them on probation, train them and then promote them until they have adequate access to all necessary commands.
3. Collaborate on what Y peak times are (based on obtaining objective and accurate information using internet tools)
4. Coordinate to employ X number of admins based on Y peak times
5. Have the time (AKA money) and capacity to manage all of this in a timely execution and if any problems/drama arise during this process

This is your solution to the “burdening” report system and GrangerPub’s inadequacy? The solution to GrangerPub’s problems is MORE admins and MORE bans and MORE demotions?

I disagree with your assessment. I think we should focus on the process of making decisions, the quality of individual admins and the quality of the tools they have. Even if you believe all of these previous factors are seriously lacking now, I do not agree that focusing on the quantity will solve more problems than it would create.

This is why features like forum reports, callvotes, registered users and /ignore are favored. This is why work is being done (both on 1.3 and the test server) on trying to create tools and features that would let the community be pro-active to issues instead of fallible admins, because your solution isn’t realistic.

Perhaps in a communist utopia where bills are nonexistent and time is plenty, this plan would be ideal. We don’t live in that world.

[Menace13]

@Hendrich

You see the current report process as burdening, I see it as necessary to ensure that we are handing out decisions to alleged violators properly.

@Hendrich

I think we should focus on the process of making decisions, the quality of individual admins and the quality of the tools they have.

These are both key statements. Quality of admins and tools they have are both extremely important, but you forgot one thing: the quality of the tools the non-admins have are just as important.

MaeJong coded a basic in-game report system which will be going live SOON™. It would be nice if we had some idea of when exactly that would be, but it’ll definitely help make this thread entirely pointless since a !report for every “gameplay disruption” would actually be handled unlike this list of unproven events.

@Hendrich

This is why work is being done (both on 1.3 and the test server) on trying to create tools and features that would let the community be pro-active to issues instead of fallible admins, because your solution isn’t realistic.

The problem with this is that Tremulous 1.3 and the test server both aren’t 1.1 or populated. What we need are tools for GrangerPub as it is now. The community doesn’t want to wait on empty promises. If we can just get MaeJong’s new shit on the server ASAP everything will be dandy, but people will continue complaining until then, and rightfully so.

[Hendrich]

@Menace13

It would be nice if we had some idea of when exactly that would be

I agree. However, as it constantly happened in the past with 1.2 on Tremulous.net, those ideas can change based on various factors, causing backlash. Whatever idea we’re going to get, it needs to be well thought out and explained before made, so if circumstances do change, the community won’t be left in the dark.

@Menace13

What we need are tools for GrangerPub as it is now. The community doesn’t want to wait on empty promises.

Unfortunately, I’m in no position to comment on that. Its definitely something that should be considered right now, by the relevant people, at this point in time.